The body's response to yeast-free bread

Hello everyone. I don’t know where to write, so sorry if that. The question has ripened a long time ago and baffles me.
A few words of background: I gave up yeast a long time ago, about 3 years or more. Although now I think: yeast still gets into the rye sourdough from the external environment, since it is everywhere in our world, but this is not the same thermophilic yeast. So I read, anyway. How I would believe it.
But then question 1: why does kvass ferment well on yeast-free bread? If all bacteria and yeast were to die in baking? And it causes such a good bubbling in the stomach after consuming it ...
But I strayed. So, the body perceives purchased yeast-free bread normally. But I don’t really believe in its absolute yeast-freeness, and there is full of all kinds of chemistry such as improvers, thickeners, etc. I dreamed to bake myself. I started a rye sourdough, the second time it turned out - no mold, with a good sour smell and bubbles. Sourdough is already about a month and a half. I learned to bake. Not exactly for guests, but I like it. But then a problem arose - a completely wild flatulence for all family members on my bread. On the purchased one was not.
And here question 2: Why does it boil in the stomach, and it boils very high quality. Moreover, the bread, as expected, does not grow moldy (unlike the purchased yeast-free, by the way)
Yes, another such moment. When I baked bread on a whim without dough - that is, sourdough + flour, water to the consistency of the ability to sculpt by hand, forming a loaf, proofing in the oven at 50 degrees for 4 hours and baking - there was no boiling, but the bread turned out fresh... As soon as I began to make dough (as it should be for black bread) for 6-12 hours, then kneading the dough, raising the dough, kneading the dough, putting it into a mold, proofing until the form is filled - about 2-3 hours and baking - that's it, then death came with oblique and a lot of rumbling nasty bubbles in my intestines .. But the bread turned out delicious, rye, sour, it is a pity that it is damp. You can't call it unbaked, but it's not dry either.
I didn't find an answer to my question on the Internet ... Maybe someone can tell me, maybe I'm somehow baking wrong .. or the leaven is not like that. I made pure rye sourdough on rye flour plus water. All. No salt or sugar. Maybe only then a little salt and sugar was added ...

Well, you must. I’ll just listen. I bake with yeast, but in my head the thought was to bake yeast-free.

Well, you must. I’ll just listen. I bake with yeast, but in my head the thought was to bake yeast-free.

Here I am the same way. Everything is yeast. And thoughts are rummaging about ... about yeast-free .... About the leaven of the topic I throw in the bookmarks "for later." All my bellies are silent.

Very strange, this is the first time I've heard of this. In my practice, there were yeast-free breads, for about two months I baked yeast-free bread with sourdough, only with wheat flour. None of the family had anything like it. The bread turned out to be excellent in taste from yeast, and did not grow moldy at all, it just dried up and that's it. You probably got the wrong wild yeast there. Do you properly withstand the technology when breeding the leaven?

Hmm, an interesting situation ... From your description it turns out that the difference in the time the sourdough is in the heat is 4 and 8-15 hours. Probably, during this time it peroxides or something extraneous multiplies in it.
When I made sourdough bread, it also turned out bland, even with the addition of salt and sugar before baking, I did not really like the taste. The addition of malt solved the problem.

[on baking powder or soda]

In my practice, there were yeast-free breads, for about two months I baked yeast-free bread with sourdough, only with wheat flour. Do you correctly withstand the technology when breeding the leaven?

LEAST-FREE BREAD is when there is no yeast in the dough at all, and the bread is baked only on baking powder or soda! Or just without lifting means at all, flat cakes are the national bread of different peoples.

And there can be no leavened bread without yeast. Sourdough is also yeast, but only of a different nature, and contains the so-called "wild yeast".
Yeast and fungi are in the air in unlimited quantities and are different in composition and purpose, and properties, including for bread. And you can easily check it yourself. Add some water, a little sour cream, curdled milk (or the like) to the flour, make a batter and leave it for a while - and you will see how the dough begins to "seethe and puff" slowly. And such examples can be cited enough, even fermentation on water.

Bread can be of the following types:
- absolutely without any lifting means (lean or unleavened cakes, for example in a frying pan)
- on baking powder, soda
- yeast-based dry active or pressed wet
- on various leavens
- on a combination of yeast and starter cultures

Based on this and you need to write and name correctly in the name of the recipe, what do you actually bake, what do you use when kneading the dough.

Post author does not know the terminology and technology of bakery, it can be seen from the text.
If the bread baking technology is violated and is not carried out, it is brewed at 50 * C, the leavens are not brought to full maturity - the stomach will definitely hurt, and not only the stomach!

[Admin]

Admin, thanks for the answer.
I was not particularly interested in terminology, but people often call sourdough bread without yeast. Including store-bought bread. I didn’t think too much .. But I don’t argue, especially since I also mentioned the presence of yeast in the leaven.
In that case, what I bake is sourdough bread. And, in order not to produce meaningless letters in vain, I immediately want to ask you to provide links to an explanatory description of the process, which is not too technologically advanced, and is feasible in an apartment.
I will only make a reservation about my leaven, as I did to decide whether to start a new one? Rye flour + warm water 50g each, plus 100g every other day, and again on the 3rd day. All.
And a few words about the oven - why at 50 * I do proofing and dough - our windows are open and the dough is cold, it seems to me, but it fits quickly in the stove. Yeast dough is always put in a warm place, I thought it would be better for sourdough too ... But how should it be? Thanks in advance for your reply.

At 50 degrees in the leaven, everything useful will die out.
Do not exceed 40 degrees during proofing and your starter will work normally.
If you have already overheated the starter culture itself, start a new one.
Go read / ask about your starter culture HERE
It makes sense to ask the authors of the recipes about the baking technology of any kind of bread in the relevant topics. Select a sourdough bread recipe in THIS SECTION or THIS and check if something is not clear.

[Nata]

Nata, Thank you!!! And I thought that if the dough is bubbling (and it bubbles very well) and the dough rises (and it rises well) in the OVEN at 50 * - then everything is in order. Naive ... And then what was left there, in my leaven ??? What raises it? Yeast? But after all, bread is baked on the same yeast - yeast, or is there some wrong yeast and they make the wrong bread? Thanks for the links - I'm already looking ...
And another question about the temperature of the proofing of dough and dough .. at room temperature - it's cold .. but what to do? the battery is not an option, do not crawl .. In room 18-22, probably .. is it like for a starter dough?

You can also use the oven. Turn it on at a minimum exactly until it becomes warm there (~ 30-35 g), turn it off immediately and put the sourdough to ripen or the dough for proofing. Heat lasts a long time in an airtight oven.I know that our girls just turned on the light bulb in the oven, it also warms a little, and everything worked out.
A good starter culture is a symbiosis of yeast and MK bacteria. High-quality rye bread cannot be obtained without such symbiosis. So you complained that the crumb was wet. This is most likely due to the fact that only yeast remained in the leaven.
You could also eat it "wrong". Rye bread should ripen after baking, or at least cool completely, otherwise the body will not digest it.

No, no, I just ate cold, and daily, and weekly, and baked in half with wheat flour (this one is perfectly baked, but also bombs) and only rye .. I know about hot bread, you don't need to eat it.
The topic about the oven - I really hope - will bring you out of the dead end, I did not know that 50 * is a lot for bacteria. Feels like it is barely warm, the grates are not hot. My oven is still a little slow, those. the degree underestimates (according to the sensations). I'll try, as you suggested, turn it off after heating.
One moment is just interesting (or maybe it should be so) - the smell of the leaven: fresh - fed - smells sour, and hungry - yeast. Can yeast inhibit bacteria? And what, now it is probably necessary to change the leaven? Throw it out, since I ruined it at 50 *?
And here's another: I read that the leaven can be stored under a lid without holes, so it ripens faster. I keep it in the refrigerator .. How much can this harm the process? It really ripens faster, but maybe it also contributes to the harmful effect of bacteria on MK?

throw it away and do it again according to the rules))) at 50 degrees and above, many useful microbes and bacteria die.
and if your stomach hurts, then it’s either really damp, add less water, or the flour may have been bad rye, or your stomach is not trained to rye. eat rye bread all the time for six months and all the rules will be))))
I also had it with my stomach, or when I also baked my own rye bread with the wrong sourdough, or when I ate the store for a long time. There are also German breads in packs in the store sold like Westphalian or others. From them, you can also accustom your tummy to the normal rye we are used to, and not wheat.

[Anna Svetlova]

Anna Svetlova, my body is still accustomed to rye bread. I'm not allowed wheat. The belly began to swell exactly on his homemade sourdough. The bread was baked normally, it seems. The belly does not react to the store-bought baked bread. But it still seems to me that it is unlikely that store-bought bread can be absolutely pure from those industrial yeast. Already threw out that old leaven. I started a new one, let's see what happens. I think overheating is to blame.

Yes, from overheating of the leaven it is possible))) - right now the thought has visited me, or maybe this is not the case at all? maybe just in the diet something was broken)))
In general, think for now, and make a new leaven))

[Anna Svetlova]

Anna Svetlova, my body is still accustomed to rye bread. I'm not allowed wheat. The belly began to swell exactly for your homemade starter culture.

Or maybe the technology of growing and exploiting starter cultures at home has just been violated? From this, as a rule, health problems are
Look at here Table of contents of the section "Ingredients and accessories for bread" in the YEAST AND SECTION section, there are interesting topics on the use of sourdoughs with bread recipes on them

Considering that the reaction to bread is sour, one can think that the intestines need to be treated for the whole family. Do not eat "standing" bread yet. How are you with your stomach, pancreas, biliary system? Maybe, than sinning for leaven, it is worth being examined? / personal opinion of a doctor and practicing fermentor with over 10 years of experience /

[Vitav]

Thank you all for your participation. I changed the leaven - I grew it at room temperature, but since it is cool here, I hid the order in a cupboard with dishes. I'm baking bread for the second time - it seems that the problem with my stomachs has disappeared. That is, 50 degrees for the leaven was too warm. And grows well at room temperature.
Vitav, thanks for the advice.There is really something wrong with the digestive system. But I never baked pure rye, I always add wheat flour and sometimes all other flours, which are also bran.

[krasnadevitsa]

krasnadevitsa, to health. The body's reaction may be to the increased acidity of the bread due to the stagnant leaven, in which case, even after bread made of premium flour, the stomach may hurt.